Video Transcript: Growing your Team

Welcome back. As I said last time, you know that today we want to look at how do you grow  the members of your team so that their capacity continues to expand. And as their capacity  expands, the capacity of your ministry will expand. This is a challenging thing. And it's very  important. I said to you last time that I would mention to you again, further explanation, the  

law of the lid. That is one of the leadership laws that John Maxwell described, he described  how personally the law of the lid can work, said "those closest to the leader will determine the success level of that leader. This is the greatest leadership principle I've learned in more than  30 years of leadership." Now, imagine that this is the greatest principle of somebody who's  been writing has been consulting, who's been teaching preaching has been leading a large  organization led large churches, growing churches, and he says, "the biggest thing I've  learned, the greatest single thing I've learned is that the people I have around me are the  ones that will push me to success, and will allow me to continue to rise in success." Now for  us, that means glory of God, of course. But this is a powerful thing, personally, the people  around you need to be people who are growing and helping you grow. And this is true  organizationally, as well. Another quote from Maxwell, "an organization's growth potential is  directly related to its personnel potential. In other words, the organization can only go as far  as your team can take it." Now, we all know there are differences in competencies we talked  about that last time about, you know, you're looking for somebody who has demonstrated  competence, well, there are some people who are more competent than another. But the  reality is, the more you are carrying people at a level, who are just skating by, the less  successful your organization is going to be. Now, that's a horrible, horrible realization for  church, I gotta tell you, because in church, you know, we have this idea that we are just so  nice to each other. And so we don't really demand stuff from each other. So, you know, I can't  tell you the number of pastors I get to talk to who will complain about a staff person, because  that Secretary does this, or that, you know, that youth pastor does this. And, or they don't  more often they don't do this, that they're crying for competence, but they don't do anything  about it. As a leader, you've got to ask your organization, if you're in pastoral leadership,  you'll often have to ask your leadership, if you're in a, a nonprofit organization or Christian  organization of some kind, you're going to have to ask your board for the permission to make  the changes necessary to keep growing people on your team. And when they stop growing, to remove them from that team, you have to have that authority, or you have to have a process  by which it's done or you're going to constantly behind be behind the eight ball in the English, English colloquialism you're going to be behind in reaching your goals and seeing the vision  become reality. So what are some principles to growing your team to greater effectiveness?  Principle number one, is this leaders attract leaders. And so the question you have to ask is,  are you a leader? Are you growing? In other words, are you constantly looking for other  levels? a greater effectiveness in your own leadership? And and can others see that and  experience that in you? Are you continuing to read about issues of leadership as well as  theology, as well as novels as well as biographies? As well as those kinds of things? Are you  growing in your capacity as an individual, but particularly in this class? Are you growing in  your capacity to lead? Are you going to seminars in order to learn more about leadership and  conferences? Because there are people there that you know, can teach you to be a better  leader? Are you somebody who, who's obviously that kind of person? Are you somebody  who's gathering with a network of leaders in order to discuss issues of leadership? Real  leaders, people with leadership gifts won't become part of your team, unless you are a leader, and people on your team will not grow in their leadership capacity unless you model it. And so the first principle is simply that leaders attract leaders. Are you a leader? Are you growing?  Now? There is a principle that I've mentioned before, I just want to spend a moment on and  that is, you know, if you picture a scale of 1 to 10, and you can picture your own leadership  capacity in that scale. So right now you're functioning at an eight let's say you're a really  terrific leader, you know, you're able to help people to find the vision, you're able to  understand the culture to find the vision, and to move people with strategic planning toward  the fulfillment of that vision. You're a leader. And so you're an eight? Well, there's a real  tendency among leaders to hire people who are not as a quality leader as themselves. And so an eight Will generally hire a six. And it's usually you know, it's, it's not consciously done. It's 

subconscious, that whether we feel threatened by those who are as good as us or better than  us, I don't know. But but it's subconscious. And so you've got to look for leaders that are your  equal or better than you. Now generally speaking, an effective leader, somebody more  effective than you won't join you in leadership, generally speaking, that's just the truth. But  you look for people who are going to be your equal in leadership, they have to acknowledge  you as leader, or you have to do it in a corporate consensus way, sometimes that's working  more and more in our new generation, as the millennials are entering leadership positions.  But are you a leader? A second principle is this. Did you create a climate? And are you  creating a climate for potential leaders? In other words, are their expectations of what they  are going to do expectations of the fact that they are going to be required to grow as part of  their experience in your organization, or in your church? And what I mean by that is, do they  have expectations? What they are doing? Are there ways to measure their growth in their  capacity to lead? That that's a tough one. Are there rewards, certainly, there are rewards  financially. And that's always nice. But you know, a variety of other ways to reward people  who are doing well, who are demonstrating growth and capacity, and one is to give them  greater responsibility. Or, you know, Napoleon Bonaparte used to say, you know, as he  handed out medals, that he's the only person who could get people to walk to their deaths for the sake of a little piece of tin on their on their chest. Are there ways you are rewarding  people who are growing, that you created this climate that yeah, you know, what, if I can  accomplish this, there's going to be this reward? And are you creating growth opportunities,  your own personal input into the staff on a regular basis? You know, people like John Maxwell  used to lecture his staff every other week, and he would put that on, on tape, and he'd send it around the country for the rest of us to listen to, but that was the way he invested in his staff  are, Is there money for your staff to go to conferences and seminars? Do you invite leaders  in? Are you creating an atmosphere, a climate where people are expected to grow, they're  expected to have their capacity expanded. And we began this a few years ago. And last  church, I served that we instead of doing an annual review, started doing a map, a ministry  action plan, and then that ministry Action Plan, which three times a year, a staff person who  lead a department would have to come up with goals with priorities, what are my priorities,  one of those quadrant two things and Stephen Covey's language, those things that are really  important, what are those things that are important for me in this next three or four months?  And how will I accomplish those? What are some of the tactics that I've used? And along with  that would be what opportunities do I expect to grasp this time? What problems do I need to  solve during these three months? And one of those things was, what am I doing to grow? In  this period of time, this three months? What am I doing to grow creating an atmosphere now,  that was a culture change for our staff, because we had 22 people on staff, 17 of them were  part time, various hours. And they were hired to do particular tasks, as we've talked about  before, you know, they were given job descriptions of hold this meeting, teach this class,  recruit these leaders, etc, etc. And so to get them to think more of how, what can I become,  how can I grow? How can I expand my capacity was a different thing. And I've shown this  before to you too. This is the the staff values that we came up with that, you know, we're  going to take personally, this, this ministry, where we're not going to just slough it off on  someone else as their responsibility. And then second value was we continuously grow. And,  you know, we evaluate regularly and are making improvements in our ministry striving for  excellence. Now, that's one way of growing, but part of that meant that they are going to  continue to grow. And so as we go over those values, every once in a while, we talk again,  how are you growing? It's one of the things that becomes part of that ministry, Action Plan  conversation, how are you growing? How are you doing those evaluations? Are you doing your own personal evaluation and How are you growing? And so you get people at a growing state  of mind, this person is Scott Wilson. I learned a lot from him, although I never heard him  speak. I did read some of his books. I put him up there because we had a major change in this and how we changed our culture as a staff began with a process that began with Scott Wilson, the key leader on my team, and I decided that we were going to go to a conference in Dallas,  Texas. So we flew down there, we stayed in a nice hotel, we walked to the church, and it was  a large conference. And what Scott Wilson was not one of the primary speakers that day, he 

was one of the ones leading a seminar. And so, you know, my, my key partner and I would go  to different seminars so that we could, you know, hopefully gain a broader perspective on the  seminar. So my partner went to hear Scott Wilson speak. And Scott described what happened  in his staff. Now, Scott, pastors a church, that's just a South Dallas area. It's now about 4000  

people in attendance on any given Sunday, weekend, rather, Saturday night service, as well.  And he described the fact that the church had reached kind of a plateau. And it was about,  you know, a decent number, but uh, but it was about 900 people. And that, that was it. They  weren't growing beyond that, no matter what they try, they tried, you know, changing some  things of the building, they tried to changing some some things in worship and welcome and  all that sort of stuff that they improved worship experience, they troubleshoot problems, that  they had all of that good stuff, and still, they're stuck there. And so he became convinced of  the law of the lid. And he became convinced that the secret was growing, the staff that he  had, having them grow in their capacity. So he got them together and basically said to them,  you know, the secret is that we got to grow, we've all got to grow. And as we grow, the church will grow. In fact, he wrote about it in a book called Ready, Set, Grow three conversations that  will bring lasting growth to your church. So what were those conversations all about? Here's  the first one, modeling a life of continued learning, I'm sorry, that turned out the way it did  that it's very blue, continual learning, modeling the life of continual learning. And what he  said there, he simply set a goal for his staff to consume vast amounts of books and CDs and  podcasts, this constant hunger for input became contagious. So he got his full time staff  together. And he said, Okay, how many books are we going to read, this is what I recommend, had a huge list of books that they were going to read. In addition, they were going to listen to  podcasts, and they were going to listen, go to conferences, and that sort of thing. And as they come back together, they would share what they were learning. And so he began to create  that atmosphere of growth, a climate for growth to happen. And so that was huge. And then  the second one second step is mentoring other leaders around you. Second step in the growth of a church or ministry leadership team is when you begin to see others in the team impacted and equipped. And so the idea was that he had these key leaders, and he spent a year with  them, reading these books, listening to podcast sharing, talking about growth opportunities,  etc. And then the idea was in year two, they were to take all of that information and work with their teams of volunteers, and maybe staff, maybe part time staff, that was year two,  mentoring the other leaders around you. And then in year three, the idea was to multiply the  number that came out kind of messed up here too, but multiply the number of leaders when  the people you work with begin multiplying themselves, so that those leaders become people  who are having an impact on the leaders further down the volunteers in particular. So these  three things, these three conversations he had with his staff. Now, most of them caught on  wonderfully, and they became part of this and were enthusiastic and energetic. And as a  result, the church took a, a leap in the next couple of years during that three year process, a  huge leap forward and began to break growth barriers after that, but it took those steps in  order to do it. Now there was one person on the staff a key person a part person who had  been a partner with him for a long period of time, and yet wasn't part of it kept. He'd show up  and now his reading wasn't done. During the time they were discussing a book, and no, he  hadn't listened to podcasts, etc. And so there were some heart to heart discussions that went  on over a period of time, and eventually, he had to fire the person now My partner and I were so excited by this process that we decided to do something similar with our team, recognizing that a lot of them were part time, we got them together the leadership team, and we just  began to talk to them about the fact that, you know, the the church's impact, we were on a  plateau about the same plateau they were on. And, and, wow, if we could increase our  capacity, what might happen to blow the lid off this place, that we'd have a broader and  deeper impact in the lives of people in the name of Jesus. And so they bought in with a little  bit of reluctance, but mostly they bought into the process. And so we were off. And we read  books, we listened to podcasts at year two we required that each of them have a leadership  team that they were investing in people who were identified as key to their particular area of  ministry. And we said, Okay, go, go and set them free. And I've got to say, it was both a  success. And it wasn't some people really caught on. Some people we realized, weren't ready 

for that depth of leadership and weren't growing in their capacity. And we'll talk about what to do about that in a moment. So principles for growth, leaders attract leaders, you got to create a climate for potential leaders. Number three is you ask for a commitment. In other words,  you verbally describe the kind of commitment you want from them as a partner in ministry  with you, and ask them to commit to that, ask them to commit themselves to growing in their  capacity, talking about what the rewards of that are for the organization, but also personally  talking about, you know, how they can make an impact in the name of Jesus in a positive way, ask for a commitment. And then you've got to commit time and energy to ongoing team  development. Now, if you're a leader, and you don't have gifts in management, or  administration, this is a tough step to take. I know that describes me. I'm somebody who  thinks, Okay, we did that. Now we've got that all down. Now we can move on to the next  thing. And that's what I like to do. On my Kolbe personality test, I come out as a quick start,  and a Fact Finder. I've shared that with you before. But as far as a carry through, I needed  some other people alongside me. Now one of the people I have alongside me for years for 10  years plus was a man who was a gifted leader. And he was somebody who kind of grew up he  was in the congregation when it started when he joined the church when they were about 50  people gathering in a rented facility in town. And when they rented the facility, he's  somebody who had started out as a teacher in junior high. And then he grew. And he went  back for further education. And he became an administrator. And he did that in a couple of  different schools. In the second school, he led them the school into a complete revision, a  brand new facility and all the stuff that goes with that incredible leadership requirements  going on in that regard. And that kind of burned him out a little bit. And so he went into  business, and he was a very successful in business for the next 11 years. But in the church,  he was he had gained a reputation for character and competence. He was somebody who was looked to for wisdom, who was consulted about stuff, he was president of the elders for a  couple of different terms. And he began to feel a call into ministry just before I showed up on  on the scene. And so he went back to get training, he couldn't go back to seminary because  of his life situation at that point. But he began to get the training necessary through a  program offered in our denomination. And so when I came along and began to meet him and  talk with him, realized this is the kind of guy I want as a partner. And so we called him to  become part of that. He became ordained later. And he was somebody who was really gifted  on the management side, I was more gifted on the vision side of what a team we were able to make, because it became his responsibility to keep on managing that stuff. Keep on managing that stuff and pick up behind me that and my administrative assistant picking up the details  after me. So you commit time and energy to this, otherwise your team will not grow. Now.  John Maxwell talks about you know, where Why do some people and where do some people  stop growing. He says some will stop growing when they've experienced some growth. Some  will stop growing when they become capable in their job and they don't feel like they have to  grow anymore. Some will stop growing when they're able to reproduce themselves and grow  to that level of leadership and, and so they're able to invest in other people, some are able to  grow, to take them to another level such as my partner I just described that they'll they'll  constantly kind of go up the ladder. Some will grow to the capacity of taking others higher.  That's very rare, but they're able to invest in other people's that they are experiencing growth in their capacity. And then there are few people who grow to the point where they, they're  able to handle any job. Now think about the people you work with right now, you will notice  that there are people that fit these various levels, right? That they do some growth, but they  stop. They're capable in the job. And that's all they do. And that's all they want. They're,  they're not going to grow into a new job. Or, they've learned to reproduce themselves, they  get to that level, they're probably keepers, you want them around for a long time. But there  are these levels that people will stop. So. So the idea is, you got to keep people who are in  that upper level, not just capable of the job, or not just some growth. But people who are the  right people like Jim Collins wrote, Good to Great as he tracked again, in the secular world,  companies that were good, but they made a leap in their life to become great companies. He  said, what's the common denominators of those people and wrote that out? It's a marvelous  book. But this is a quote from him. "In fact, leaders of companies that go from good to great 

starting arc start not with where do we want to go? But with who is going to get us there?  They start by getting the right people on the bus, the wrong people off the bus, and the right  people in the right seats." Now, that's a simple concept, right? You're gonna go somewhere,  says the people who are going to take you there. So even before you define your vision,  totally, you got to define who are the right people? Who are the kind of people who will  represent the kind of characteristics we've been talking about in the last session. And then  this one, who are they? And with them, you know, use them help depend on them as you're  developing the vision more carefully as you're looking at strategic planning lean on them. But  if you need the right people on the right, on the bus in the right seats. What do you do if you  don't have the right people? It's been my privilege in ministry to interact with a lot of leaders  and a lot of different pastors and churches. And I've got to tell you, this is one of the  complaints very often, even in growing ministries. You know, I can't tell you how many people  I listened to that said, you know, what, we've got this worship leader say, and you know, he's  been with the church, 10 years, 11 years, 12 years, whatever, long time, 7 years, and we've  gotten to this level. Said but I've become convinced he's not the person that's going to take  us to the next level. So what do I do? Or we got this person that, you know, we hired we  thought we had great potential, but they don't have it turns out, they can't do what we want  them to do. We're not succeeding in this particular area. What do we do? And the answer is  well you can fire them. It's hard in a church. I've done that and it can be very destructive,  very painful. I fired the first person baptized in one of the churches I served. So caused great  upheaval, but it was the right move. We needed to make significant changes in youth  ministry. And and we were able to do that with the next person we hired but firing's an option, reassigning is there some other job that they could do at their level of competence within the  organization, you need a pretty big organization in order to do that. Or number three, you can help them find a preferable future, you can have some speaking the truth that loves sessions  with them. I think one man who joined our staff, he was an intern. So he was doing finishing  up seminary, and he was spending time with us learning how to do the details or the the skills of ministry. And we recognized some gifts in him. And so when he was done with that year of  internship, we called him to become our director of education. And he did that for three years. And we determined that he had reached a level in that position that the that there wasn't  anywhere for him to go from there. And so I had some discussions with him a lot. His his  sense of call into ministry is, is this really what you thought you were going to do? Because I'd had conversations with him all along, says, you know, when you talked about ministry, when  you talked about as a child feeling that sense of calling to become a pastor, it wasn't to do  this? What is your preferable future? And together, we came to the conclusion that no, he was going to withdraw his application for we call them on a term call, which is something in our  system, where we call them for three years, and now it was time to either confirm that call for the future, or to change and, and, you know, to have honest conversations are one of the  things I hate about the church. I love the church of Jesus Christ. But when you're having these tough conversations, it's easy to not be truthful. And so I want to call for that. And they are  tough, tough conversations. So that's getting the right people on the bus, in the right seats is  vital to your responsibility as a leader, to bring that organization toward the vision that God  has given you for it. Now, just one parting thought. When you're dealing with your team, there can be a confusion about whether you are a pastor, or whether you are a boss. When do you  take off the pastor hat, and when are you take the boss because you've hired friends, if  you've hired from within, you've hired people who are friends of yours, and they see you as  pastor and they look to you for care, pastoral care, but there are some times you got to put  the boss hat on. And that's these times, when they are not meeting expectations. You've got  to put your boss hat on, got to be say, I can't be your, you know, I I'm your boss right now.  And these are the issues when things aren't going well in their department. That's when you  have to put the boss hat on, you can care for them, truthfully, you care for them. But you  can't just let things go the way they're going if they aren't going successfully and that going  well. And in times of conflict, especially between people on your staff, you have to be the  boss, not the pastor. And when there's a tough call to make. You're the one who's got to bite  the bullet and put on the boss hat. It's easy for us as pastors, at least me to love that pastor 

hat and love to be loved. But there are times you got to put on the boss hat. So, so we talked  about your team. Now in the next session, we're going to talk about conflict. Because  sometimes conflict will happen on your team. It's inevitable. It will certainly happen within  your church, how you handle conflict will be a key element and whether you move forward as  an organization or not, so we will check in with you next time.