Henry - So we're back at the last meeting that was kind of grueling to go through all the old  customs, we didn't even talk about Solomon. How many wives did he have? Unknown  Speaker 0:14 Pam - He had was one was 300 and 700 of the other. So do you have 700  wives and 300 concubines or 300? A lot? What? Anyway? Yeah. 1000 women, Unknown  Speaker 0:30 Henry - yeah. Turn his heart away from God. And really, when it comes to it, it's  become idolatry, not just adultery, it becomes a preoccupation, becomes worship in pleasure.  It is fascinating that a lot of the pagan occult in the Old Testament and New Testament were  so much oriented around sexual expression as well. Yes, you know, so I mean, so today,  we're going to look at the New Testament, and how it sees the world. Unknown Speaker 1:08  Pam - And we are, okay. Sexual immorality is a sin against your body. I Corinthians 6:18. Flee from sexual immorality, all other sins a man commits are outside his body, but he was sin  sexually sins against his own body.  

Henry - You know, I have often thought about that, in what sins? , are you sinning against  your own body, and you know, a couple of things come to mind that I'll see what what comes  to your mind. And I've studied it, I've noticed that sexuality has a components of a arousal, it  has a component, there's the brain, there's the dopamine, there's the it changes you as a  person. So even creationally sexual morality, we also know that there are sexually transmitted diseases. And, you know, there's, with you know theres that popular movie about Queen and  Freddie Mercury, and the movie depicted that at some point, he was less interested in making music. And he was more interested in just the party lifestyle, and he paid a high price. Now,  that's not you know, the big thing is, you can't say that you're condemning anything or you  know, because it's very unpopular. I just feel  

Pam - it's history.  

Henry - Right. But you see that a lifestyle does, you know, sinned against and I've seen in  you've seen that in ministry, where do you seem somebody goes down this trail, and they get  more sickly? Maybe not even disease, they just, they wither away, the more they give  themselves to sexual pleasure. Especially, again, but weirdly,  

Pam - with a lot of differences. Oh, yeah.  

Henry - But but we're this class. We are  

Pam - dealing with this topic here. No, yeah, exactly. No,  

Henry - they did some studies was really interesting. And we in our various studies came  upon this, and I just popped in my mind now, if I repeat the study that might be in another  class somewhere, that that a husband wife, and monogamy if you have the same sexual  

partner, there's actually health that comes between each other even in the very like  ejaculation fluid in that. Like, what all of that is very interesting how, you know, there was  some, you know, major study done on on that. So, you can see the like Paul puts it right to  sexual immorality is a sin against your body, your body, you know, and then he would actually  know that.  

Pam - Yeah, sexual immorality assumes most of the Old Testament condemnations and many of the pagan practices. 

Henry - In fact, you see that in I Corinthians 5:1, it is  

Pam - actually reported that there is sexual immorality among you and of a kind that does not  occur even among pagans, a man has his father's wife. Okay, so you see some? Yeah, well,  this brings up a good issue about culturally agreed upon sexual issues, age of consent and  marriage are self evident in some cultures that are different in other cultures.  

Henry - And I think that's an interesting too, like, there's Why is 18 the age of consent? And  not 15 Mary, the mother of Jesus might have been 15 or 14 , you know, and so there is you  know, and I think in every culture, some of those issues come up. So they're, you know, so  

we're we are about one man one woman marriage worldview and sex in sexuality in that  context, but there is in different cultures. And that's just how it is.  

Pam - All right, male and female homosexuality, Romans 1:26 and 27. Because of this, God  gave them over to shameful lust, even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural  ones. In the same way, the men also abandoned the natural relations with women, and were  inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed shameful acts with other men, and  received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion. I Corinthians 6:9, do you not  know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God Do not be deceived, neither? Neither  the sexually immoral nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor male prostitutes or homosexual  offenders? So it  

Henry - goes on in a couple of things. Now, I know that that passage in Corinthians can be  referring to forms of abuse, I get that. But that first one does talk specifically about  exchanging natural relations, and natural relations is a man and a woman in a marital  sexuality, and then replacing it with same sex sexuality. Now, the apostle Paul, in that  passage is describing what happened to the ancient times. But, you know, but going forward  to saying that, that one man, one woman, marriage view, and sexuality view is definitely the  biblical approach. And he mentioned that do they had their due penalty for their conversion in  themselves? And so, you know, what does that mean? Well, one thing it could mean, again,  that I don't want to be an expert, that I know everything, but one suggestion that I think is  plausible there is that they couldn't have children, because creationally speaking, same sex,  sexual encounter, does not bring children which would have been a high prize in that era, in  that time. And that penalty is I have no heirs, no legacy. But it also he would say, goes against the very creational order of how God designed man and woman, male and female. The  reason this comes up is because this is a hot topic right now, in the world, most of the  Levitical laws would be agreed upon as self evident, but same sex sexuality is now something that is becoming more popular. It's also because we've separated child bearing, and  reproduction from sexuality. We talked about that, in previous ones, Roe v. Wade, and  Margaret Sanger. And so sex is just about pleasure. And to have a children is a choice you  make with family planning, and all of that stuff. So we're going to see a trend more and more  that sex is reduced to its pleasure aspect, apart from family, and all of those things in the  penalty, Paul would say is like, we're missing out on that. But many people would say, I want  to miss out on and I'm not interested in children. So why don't I just do whatever I want to do.  And therefore, you get to that second passage, where now you create a new world of idolatry. I am just about myself. I'm just about my pleasure. You know, in you see that in songs in the  culture, I kissed the girl I liked it, you know, it's like, is that what we love about and here's  where ministry comes in. I mean, people are struggling with all these worldviews. And we're  not trying to and again, we want to be very careful that is Jesus Christ or not at all, the gospel 

is not reduced to, you know, to some specific thing if somebody feels attracted to same sex or not. But the gospel is about saving them from idolatry, saving them from their past. And so it's  it is highly complicated, and without starting to, you know, get out of some bandwagon to  reduce the gospel to a lifestyle. It still must in ministry, we are here to relate to communicate  to and we don't have to agree on every choice. Some that were that someone else is doing  for us to still want to reach them. Does that make sense, I guess I want my wife here on this  because this is a sensitive issue today. Our goal is not to make the gospel into one specific  issue. Well, then there's this issue.  

Pam - All right, swinging sex is condemned. Revelation 2:12, to the angels at church and  Pergamum write. And then 14 says, Nevertheless, I have a few things against you, you have  people there who hold to the teaching of Balaam, who taught Balak to entice the Israelites to  sin by eating food sacrificed to idols, and by committing sexual immorality, likewise, you also  have those who hold to the teaching of the Nicolaitans, repent, therefore, otherwise, I will  soon come to you and will fight against them with the sword of my mouth.  

Henry - So the teachings of the Nicolaitans is generally understood as the teaching of  Nicolas, one of the seven deacons ordained in the book of Acts chapter 6. And he, and you  can read about it, you just go to Wikipedia and kind of see that and they point to some of the  early church fathers who talk about how Nicolas was rebuked by the other disciples, because  he had jealousy about his as the story goes, and beautiful wife and then he took such offense, that then he went into a wife sharing sexuality cult, and they were Christians, who became  swingers. And if we look back at it, like really, but we also know that stuff like this happens  today, too. But that is not the biblical worldview. It's one man one woman sexuality, but it's  fascinating in the New Testament, one of the seven deacons likely lead people into error. So  again, as a minister, he's a deacon minister. Here's a guy who left the biblical understanding  of sexual intimacy and lead others astray.  

Pam - All right, what about polygamy in the Old Testament, it was allowed. In the New  Testament frowned upon and no for ministers. I Timothy 3:2, now the overseer must be above reproach. The husband of but one wife, temperate, self controlled, respectable, hospitable,  able to teach. Verse 12 of I Timothy 3, a deacon must be the husband of but one wife, and  must manage his children and his household. Well, Titus 1:6, an elder must be blameless, the husband of but one wife, a man whose children believe, and they're not open to the charge of  being wild and disobedient,  

Henry - okay. So I know in some places in the world where Christian Leaders Institute goes  to, there is still polygamy being practiced. We see that the New Testament that practice  though, still allowed in the early church, was not a practice. That's ultimately back to Genesis  chapter two, with one man, one woman, so But it's interesting to say in the Old Testament,  polygamy is allowed and like King David, Solomon, and a lot of other people, especially if they had money, had more than one wife, that in the New Testament is still happening in the  culture. But the Bible is moving or the New Testament is saying, no, there are troubles and  problems. And you know, it's interesting. We were looking at all of for a lot of the Leviticus  passages. And one of them was about this whole thing about Sister Wives. Oh, yeah. You  know, what was that again? It was?  

Pam - No, I don't remember the idea was don't marry your wife. 

Henry - Rival a rival wife, rival sister wife.  

Pam - Why yes. called her rival sister wife. Because yeah, that would be caused the rivalry  between the sisters and then there would be issues  

Henry - so as ministers Yeah. What do we make of all that? Of all ministers with now the New  Testament. Now, we didn't mention things we mentioned before about Hebrews led marriage  to be honored by all keep the marriage bed pure, right. And we're going to actually get into it  more. Yes, exactly. No, we're gonna get into more of some of these things. And later  presentations. Yeah. So what's the value of knowing the Old Testament that are  Understanding of sexual practice and the New Testament understanding of sexual practice, in basically we can come up with like four or five things that's really important. First is to be  Biblically literate on the subject, you know, know where the passages are understand them.  And second is to, as a minister, as a servant, be able to help people themselves process how, what does this mean? You may, for instance encounter someone who is now in a same sex  relationship, very unhappy, there's something going on, you can approach at it like to be very  judgmental, where you just condemn this, or you can actually get into the journey that, you  know, the Bible talks about that in the Bible. You know, there were all these practices there.  But Jesus Christ is the Savior. So, you know, but because if you don't know, all these  passages, the third thing is the Bible has a clear worldview. And that worldview is simply God  created, male and female, he blessed them and he wants males and females to have  pleasure, sexual pleasure, in that marriage bed to be honored by all okay, so it's clear and  when the when people stray from that the Bible Bibles look at it is frowned upon, like in  polygamy, or said that it sins against one's own body? Or creates a world where our cultural  brand, biblical speaking, brings blessing. And if you look at the the whole world, if everybody  were to go same sex, would we have even any world, we wouldn't have children now with  technology, right? So you could figure out solutions. But you're gonna see that God is self  evident that God created a world where all that was needed for the, for the human race to do  well and enjoy the pleasure that was given to humans. And as ministers to know that and to  be able to teach that, in a very loving and compassionate way is very, very important. Is there  anything else that strikes you? Did I pretty much cover all the bases? As you looked at the  Old and New Testament? How do you feel about that? How do you feel about having, like all  these passages, and there's so many about sex I know in the Bible is a lot about money, too.  But there's so much about sexual experience.  

Pam - I'm thankful the Bible does address these things and give us some guidelines. And  

Henry - yeah, that's right. For you, the Bible actually deals with the hard thing. So I love you  brought that point up, because that's why we have we too, let's not be silent about it. Let's get  into conversation engage the Bible does. And we would talk about money and I know some  pastors talk about money a lot in America because money is a big pursuit. But sex also was a  big pursuit. And so this is something that we too need to talk about as ministers and as  married couples with our families. 



Modifié le: mercredi 28 septembre 2022, 12:55