Abby – I'm going to start with shaking your hands. It's awesome to have you  here. It's been a joy to have you stay at my house as well. But I know some of  you have kind of before heard my dad say I shook the man or the hand of the  man who has shook this man's hand. So who's hand have I just shook besides  yours, I guess that maybe he's famous, maybe some of you students would  know. 

Dr. Clouser – I don't know that they would. People that I know, who are  prominent in their field are not prominent in fields that people normally think that  like movie stars or rock stars, something like that. I certainly shook the hand of  the man, the philosopher, I wrote about this, Professor Herman Dooyeweerd of  the Free University of Amsterdam. And he's the one who wrote this Christian  philosophy that I think so highly of. I wrote a book or two about that. And I've  been doing courses here. So there's a few other people when I was still playing  in an orchestra, I met Aaron Copland, the composer and Robert Moody the  conductor. Is that the kind of thing you have in mind?  

Abby - Yeah, I think that's awesome. I'm sure there's a lot more hands I'm  shaking that are people that prominently you guys might start learning about  here at CLI and even have been reading books from and things like that. So it's  great to shake your hand have you here and yeah, so we did ask them about  work, as I was saying about some questions for you that maybe some of you  students have been mulling over in your head and, or are just curious about  what his philosophical point of view would be on it. So first of all, just kind of a  funny one. Justin asked, How are you today? How are you doing today? Are I  know you just finished up, okay. You're tired? You're exhausted? Tired? Yes.  Well, you fly out tomorrow. So it's gonna be another exhausting day, but then  you'll be back at home sweet home. Good. Okay. So to get to some of those  philosophical questions, we have Gordon asked, So the question of Free Will  versus determinism, is it a significant issue for Christians? Or is it one that we  should individually struggle with? And what's kind of your viewpoint on that? So  that's from Gordon?  

Dr. Clouser - Well, I think it is significant, I think it's important. The Bible nowhere uses the expression free will, but it everywhere assumes it. And I think that's  always been held by Christians, that we have significant, genuine freedom, and  we are responsible for what we do. So that's why there's, there's a final  judgment, you know, Christ returns and the Divine Court, he says, we're held  accountable for what we did. I think that's true predestination, as I understand  that means that God has chosen those whom to whom He will give grace and  make himself known. That doesn't mean that God has before hand decided  every move you'll ever make every thought you'll ever think, and actually forces 

everything on you. So you're, in effect a robot, there not your choices? That's  not That's not the way Scripture uses the term.  

Abby - Yeah, no, I think that's that's a very good answer. So Gordon, hopefully  you're watching this and could here Roy's thoughts on that. All right. The next  one we have from Ernest is it possible for Christians. This is kind of related to  will to be in the will of God and still be miserable. I figured that'd be a yes.  

Dr. Clouser - We read the whole history of Israel, right? There are God's people  they're trying to serve him. Did they ever have rough time? Were they ever  attacked? Was anybody who ever, how about the prophet Isaiah, Prophet  Isaiah, was executed by being sawn in pieces? That sounds pretty gruesome.  Of course, Daniel was saved, he's tossed to the lions and God shuts, the lions  mouths. We got promises that he'll be with us through whatever we have to  endure. But he doesn't promise us that it's going to be a bed of roses all the  time.  

Abby - right, exactly. Okay, good. And so Charlie said, he would like to know  what your viewpoints are on loved ones that have passed away. And if you feel  that they are still here in spirit, so what's your kind of philosophy on that?  

Dr. Clouser - I think the best indications we have come from the New Testament. And the book of Revelation envisions those who have died in the faith and who  are in heaven with Christ, know what's going on here. They pray for us. So I  don't think that there are spirits here, that they may be in heaven, but they know  what what we're facing, and they pray for us. That's what happens in the book of Revelation. They go before the throne of God, and on behalf of the Christians  being persecuted, they say, God, how long? At least in my church, we remember those who have died. And we're not trying to pray for them. In the sense that  they need salvation. They're already in heaven, but we commend them to the  Lord again.  

Abby - Great answer. So Charlie, tune in and listen to that. So Robert says what  is the ontological argument for the existence of God in simple In understandable terms  

Dr. Clouser - it's one of the hardest arguments that's ever been made. It's  difficult to understand. And people are all over the map on it. There have been  great philosophers have thought that that was just nothing but a charlatans trick  that isn't even worth bothering with. And other very bright, equally abled people  have thought it's amazing. It's just it hits everything just right. I'm going to  answer a slightly different question. That's, that's an attempt to prove the 

existence of God. I think that proving the existence of God is, is a misjudgment.  It's, it's a mistake. It's something we shouldn't be doing. I can tell you why fairly  quickly. The New Testament the Old Testament all tell us that God created  everything but Colossians 1 is more definite than the other places. God has  created everything, whether visible or invisible. Now that's covers everything.  Everything's either visible, or it's not. It's called a tautology. All right, if that's so  the God has created the laws by which we prove things, the laws of logic and  the laws of mathematics. In that case, those laws don't apply to God. He's their  origin. It's not that he breaks them. They just don't apply. If you insist on applying them to God and trying to prove he exists. You demote God to being more and  more creature in the universe, subject to the laws that he actually created. And I  think that's a big mistake. We know God because we encounter God we  experience God don't because we can have them be the conclusion of a logical  argument.  

Abby - Okay, awesome. Okay, so Greg asks, why, in your opinion, do so many  people claim to be religious yet will deny the existence of Christ and or God of  the Bible, especially when it explains so much and it will and then will follow  another God or religion?  

Dr. Clouser - Okay. That went around in the loop. From my point of view, I think  that they have another God or religion, whether the even people that are  unconscious of it can have a religious conviction. And because they have that  one, when they hear the biblical one, they say, No, that can't be right because  it's not consistent with the one they already hold, I think Romans 1 gives us a  hint about that. People have rejected God, they put something else in his place.  So now when you present the gospel, they say, Well, that doesn't sound like the  truth. Now the only way that that changes, according to the New Testament, is if  the Holy Spirit of God comes and gives the person Grace removes the blindness of their heart, they will see then, they directly see that the gospel is the truth  about God from God. Paul says in Ephesians 1, he told us talking to the people  in the church, before you didn't believe but then now you see with the eyes of  your mind the truth.  

Abby - Okay, so this is a long one from Christina. She said, I just read the  healing presence by Leanne Payne. And I love it. It's not easy to read though,  the one thing she talks about is the difference between the transcendent God  outside of us and the imminent, God within us. She writes, somebody says, I  worship the God within me, she found that a dangerous statement because we  should always look up to the transcendent God and worship him, I understand  the danger that somebody will become too introspective and up worshipping  himself. On the other hand, I liked the thought of Jesus living in me and talking 

to him like he's really close. Is there a difference in worship and intimate  intimacy with God in regards to that?  

Dr. Clouser - No. Okay, all right, I'm not really gonna stop there. The  transcendent God, is the creator of everything and beyond anything we can  know or imagine, is also the imminent God that lives within us. He's the God  who came incarnate in Christ, and lives with us, by means of the spirit now, so  that there aren't two Gods. And you don't have to worry about when you worship or pray, whether you're thinking of God as the Spirit within us or thinking of God,  beyond anything we can imagine.  

Abby - So you don't think that that is a dangerous statement as long as  Dr. Clouser – That's why I started with no. 

Abby - all right, there you go Christina. All right. If you could be face to face with  Jesus what is one question you would ask him? 

Dr. Clouser - how much longer do I have to live?  

Abby - Really? You would want to know that? Oh, yeah, I  

Dr. Clouser – Oh, yeah, I think when you're young, it wouldn't be a good idea to  know when you're going to die. You got a long way and it doesn't matter. And  young people think that they're immortal anyway. It's way down the road feeling  that you're not and I gotta, I would like to know how to spend my time and  money. Big difference if I'm really only going to live five more years or 15. That  makes a big difference. I haven't gotten any letters from heaven telling me how  long I'm going to live but I'd be curious about that.  

Abby - I didn't expect an answer, but I gotcha. Okay. All righ, Dr. Roy. What's  your view on Pascal Lydon? I used to do to read that book, which is on the  original question.  

Dr. Clouser - This is a little subtle, but I'll try to make it as clear as I can as  quickly as I can. Pascal believed that we know God, because we experienced  God. He says that we know God in the same way we know an axiom, we just  see it to be true. Okay. That's in the pulsate, then, when he gave the wager  argument, it was not to show that God exists. And a lot of people misunderstand it as a proof that we should believe in God, even if we don't see it to be true.  That's not what he's doing. The critics of his friends are saying that belief in God  is just nuts. It's completely irrational. How could you? How could you believe this

sort of thing? And his reply here was to show that it's not irrational, not that it's  true. Okay, so he says, line up all the advantages to believing and the  disadvantages line up all the advantages to not believing and all the  disadvantages. And you'll find that by believing you have everything to gain and  nothing to lose, and by not believing you have everything to lose, and nothing to  gain. So are you telling me that's not irrational? It's rational, I didn't try to show  it's true. For that he thinks you have to have the direct intervention of the Spirit  of God, removing the blindness of your heart, and then you can see it as true.  Somewhat, in the way we see axioms is true, he says, it's like the first principles  of number, times, space, and motion.  

Abby - Sheila are actually I'm going to do because we're running out of time.  Okay. So this is going to be the last one for today. If the dead ones are not  capable of crossing over because of the great change. How come Samuel was  summoned by a medium during the request of King Saul?  

Dr. Clouser - Okay. In the parable, Jesus tells in the New Testament about the  wicked man, the rich man who was wicked, who didn't care about God and  didn't care about the poor and he dies and goes to hell. And he being in hell  says, Abraham, please send the messengers to my brother. So they don't come  here. And it's an Abraham says, there's a great chasm. canyon between you and me, and you can't cross over and I can't go there. Alright, that's, that's true in the story of Samuel. However, King Saul tries to conjure up Samuel he gets a witch  to try it. And, like most witches, she's a phony him. Someone Samuel really  shows up, she's definitely scared. But the question is, if the rich man in Jesus  parable couldn't cross because there's a chasm between hell, and Abraham,  how could Samuel have returned to King Saul, even briefly? And I think the  answer is that Samuel was a faithful prophet of God. And he was not in Hell with a chasm separating him from Abraham. He was with Abraham, he's in another  place, and apparently, you're able to appear with special permission from God.  

Abby - Okay. Well, that makes sense. Well, thank you so much. For your time. I  will say it has been such a blessing to have you here this past week and a half,  two weeks, and kind of hear some of the wisdom that you've had with being 81.  I'm once again only 19. And I still don't really know what exactly. Yeah, he's only  

80. Okay, only 80 got it. But But yes, it's been such an honor to get to meet you.  Yeah. And I look forward to having you back again. I heard you're coming back.  And we've got Oh, thank you guys for tuning in and submitting some of these  questions. It was a real fun joy to read them and kind of get a chance to speak  with him about it. So tune in next week as we'll be starting a new month.



Última modificación: lunes, 10 de julio de 2023, 12:53